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Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116287] Tue, 22 May 2012 07:33 Go to next message
Jughandle10
Messages: 109
Registered: April 2011
Location: Mercer County New Jersey
Senior Member
Make of this what you will... not sure i have enough evidence beyond the anecdotal, but (possibly?) worth thinking about?

Bell Crack, which for years has sold out their slots pretty quickly, more than failed to fill up, only placing 25 out of 32 possible teams.

Chesapeake, one of the biggest tournaments on the east coast scene, failed to have enough womens teams interested for their open division.

Rumblings that some major tournaments in June and July are struggling to fill up from people that know things.

POultry Days still sold out no problem, and I'm guessing the same will go for Potlatch in spite of possibly conflicting with USA-U, but for alot of the tournametns that are regulars on the club scene, it seems that numbers are down.

Might be a small sample size issue, might be a combination of lots of small factors adding up to a minor dip (exaggerated by small sample size issues), might be something more.

Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116292 is a reply to message #116287] Tue, 22 May 2012 08:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tonyleonardo
Messages: 137
Registered: April 2010
Senior Member
It's been maybe 4 year since I'd last been to Bell Crack and it seemed almost exactly the same to me. I thought the Sly Fox was a major drop off from other Philly independent beer distributors of the past (wasn't there Victory kegs one year? Or Stoudt's?) but that's about it.

Not sure why women's teams at Chesapeake would sign up for Open but i reckon that does happen for some of those ballers.

Also, East Coast-wise I definitely know that the AUDL has directly affected the Mixed scene -- two NY-area teams (D5, Gun Totin') have temporarily or permanently disbanded partially due to the Connecticut Constitution. Amp only brought 1 team to Bell Crack and I would bet the AUDL franchise in Philly is part of that.

Same with Rhode Island.

Also for what it's worth I heard a peculiar reason for the absence of our Canadian counterparts Onyx and Odyssey who both usually make the trip: a split within those the leadership of those teams kept both at home this year. No reason to suggest they won't be back next year.

So add it up and that's at least 5 teams that are regularly at BC and weren't this year. Anomaly is my call.

Still with all the diminished competition it's disappointing to go 0-5 on Saturday. Had there been better teams maybe it would have lessened the sting?
Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116294 is a reply to message #116287] Tue, 22 May 2012 09:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bulb
Messages: 1093
Registered: September 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Senior Member
Jughandle10 wrote on Tue, 22 May 2012 10:33
Bell Crack, which for years has sold out their slots pretty quickly, more than failed to fill up, only placing 25 out of 32 possible teams.

That is simply a consequence of the fact that there was never a post to RSD announcing the opening of registration (something I only learned a few days before the tournament). I don't blame the TDs, though - they were first time TDs, and honestly I think they did a great job. They should've had someone looking over their shoulder to make sure the basic stuff (like announcing the tournament on RSD) got done.

tonyleonardo wrote on Tue, 22 May 2012 11:50
So add it up and that's at least 5 teams that are regularly at BC and weren't this year. Anomaly is my call.

Given that we usually have a waitlist of ~7 teams and that we were 7 teams short this year, that still leaves ~12 teams unaccounted for. Anomaly seems less likely than the lack of RSD post, IMHO. Razz
Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116296 is a reply to message #116294] Tue, 22 May 2012 10:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tonyleonardo
Messages: 137
Registered: April 2010
Senior Member
RSD factor = 12 teams?

I guess I can see that. Interesting that it carries that factor/amount
Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116298 is a reply to message #116292] Tue, 22 May 2012 10:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jughandle10
Messages: 109
Registered: April 2011
Location: Mercer County New Jersey
Senior Member
Bulb, i could see that being for a few teams (add the fact that details were very slow to come on scores.usaultimate.org), but not 12. There are lots of major tournaments that don't advertise on rsd and do just fine.

The fact that there are other little nuggets of information I am hearing

The 7 teams missing was one thing, the extra on the waitlist was quite another.


I think AUDL may be taking a piece off the top in the northeast, though it's hard to know quite how much of a factor that is.

I personally think there are lots of little factors that are adding up to make this club scene become more sparsley populated. This year it doesn't matter so much, but next year it could be a big deal. If some other tournament ends up 10 teams short instead of 7, thats 3-4 grand of extra revenue they are missing. Given that many of the costs for these kinds of events are fixed (no 20% rebate on fields, you're not getting only 75% of an emt instead of 100%), this could be pretty significant down the road.

Again, not enough evidence to say that this + chesapeake wasn't a one off, but it's quite possible.

Tony: I'm sure your chesapeake comment was snarky, but in case it wasnt, there are an elite and open divisions within each of the 3 major competitions (O/M/W). They decided not to move forward with the women's open division, which is a significant blow to teams that might have been 5th or 6th in the old mid-atlantic or northeast regions, but probably won't get into the elite division.

I was out of town for bell crack. Still a dissappointing weekend, but that just makes 4 years in a row we've played poorly there. I am starting to think there is something to renaming your team if you are bringing a tryout squad!


Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116307 is a reply to message #116298] Tue, 22 May 2012 12:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bulb
Messages: 1093
Registered: September 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Senior Member
Jughandle10 wrote on Tue, 22 May 2012 13:45
Bulb, i could see that being for a few teams (add the fact that details were very slow to come on scores.usaultimate.org), but not 12. There are lots of major tournaments that don't advertise on rsd and do just fine.

A lot of major tournaments reach out to teams in other ways, typically through direct email, leaguevine, USAU Ultimate, etc. Bell Crack has always relied on two channels: RSD and the PADA forum. Cutting out one of those channels is obviously going to have a major impact on the number of teams submitting bids.

You are right that not having details on score reporter may also have contributed, but I'll throw that into the same category as the RSD issue; it's not a sign of a change in the times, it was just an administrative oversight.
Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116336 is a reply to message #116307] Wed, 23 May 2012 05:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
muffnmen
Messages: 3
Registered: April 2012
Junior Member
Muff did not attend this year because we have later tryouts. We did not think we could bring a full squad of tryouts for the competitive division so it was not worthwhile and the lower pool would not have been a real benefit with what we had. It is a great tourney and next year we hope to bring an alum team for fun rather than tryout purposes. May is too early for us to make our decisions and we instead decided to have tryouts and cuts prior to the first tourney we attend. Given that, I am sure the lack of many teams that attended year after year made a dent in attendance and RSD certainly would have helped bring new teams in.

See you all at the next east coast gig (Philly Invite)

Nern
Re: Peak Club Tournaments? [message #116390 is a reply to message #116287] Wed, 23 May 2012 06:30 Go to previous message
ulticritic
Messages: 8204
Registered: April 2009
Senior Member
On May 22, 10:35 am, Dan Naylor <jughandl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Make of this what you will... not sure i have enough
> evidence beyond the anecdotal, but (possibly?) worth
> thinking about?
>
> Bell Crack, which for years has sold out their slots pretty
> quickly, more than failed to fill up, only placing 25 out of
> 32 possible teams.
>
> Chesapeake, one of the biggest tournaments on the east coast
> scene, failed to have enough womens teams interested for
> their open division.
>
> Rumblings that some major tournaments in June and July are
> struggling to fill up from people that know things.
>
> POultry Days still sold out no problem, and I'm guessing the
> same will go for Potlatch in spite of possibly conflicting
> with USA-U, but for alot of the tournametns that are
> regulars on the club scene, it seems that numbers are down.
>
> Might be a small sample size issue, might be a combination
> of lots of small factors adding up to a minor dip
> (exaggerated by small sample size issues), might be
> something more.
>
> --
> Posted fromhttp://www.rsdnospam.com

and just wait untill the audl gets roots and expands.........the whol
lanscape of elite ultimate will be changed for ever
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